Facts, Not Fiction

 
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    #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halfmiler2 View Post
    The IRS numbers for 2017 were just released:

    The Top 1% had 21% of the Adjusted Gross Income (AGI) but paid 38% of the income taxes. Their threshold was $515K of AGI.

    The Top 5% had 37% of the AGI but paid 59% of the income taxes. Their threshold was $208K of AGI.

    The Top 10% had 48% of the AGI but paid 70% of the income taxes. Their threshold was $145K of AGI.

    The bottom 50% pay only 3% of the income taxes.
    And this says nothing about tax rates; do you think that it does? Also, the comment about the 1% misses that the real questions are about the 0.1%; as pointed out above, the high earners get a lot from wage-type income, it is the thinner earnings at the top that get special tax treatments, such as they pushed very hard for in the most recent tax bill.
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    #12
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    Of course it says plenty about tax rates. Do the math: 38 divided by 21 is more than 1.0 which would be average. So the remaining 99% of taxpayers must be under 1.0 or under average.In fact, the ratio for the bottom 50% is almost very small.

    But here are the actual average tax rates for each income group according to the IRS for 2017.

    27.1% - Top 1%
    19.1% - Top 5% to Top 1%
    14.0% - Top 10% to Top 5%
    10.6% - Top 25% to Top 10%
    7.7% - Top 50% to Top 25%
    3.6% - Bottom 50%

    The IRS does not break out the Top 0.1%.

    Keep in mind that the above is only federal income tax and does not include state & local income taxes.

    One thing that does not get much attention is that the most common “loophole” to high income earners is the federal tax-free treatment of interest from state & local government bonds. But with the extremely low interest rates of the past decade, this is not nearly the tax-break that it used to be.
    Last edited by Halfmiler2; 11-30-2019 at 09:27 PM.
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    #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halfmiler2 View Post
    14.0% - Top 10% to Top 5%
    Something's off there. I pay ~15% and I sure ain't in the top 10%!
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    #14
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    The average tax rate is the tax you pay divided by your entire AGI. It is not your tax bracket which is your marginal tax bracket - the tax you pay on your last dollar earned.
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    #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atticus View Post
    Something's off there. I pay ~15% and I sure ain't in the top 10%!
    One of the most amazing realizations every April is that we find out that we are paying a far greater percentage in taxes than the average billionaire.
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    #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by user4 View Post
    One of the most amazing realizations every April is that we find out that we are paying a far greater percentage in taxes than the average billionaire.
    Your post seems to confuse assets with income. Further, so-called tax breaks or so-called loopholes, are intentional, for the greater good. Tax breaks for charity contributions are good. They generally get resources to those who need them better than government.
    If you take Warren Buffett as an example, Berkshire Hathaway employs almost 400,000 at an annual average salary of over $60,000. Assuming 15%, his employees pay $360,000,000 in taxes every year. Given that his salary is about $100,000, what should his income tax rate be?
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    #17
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    was highjacking the bribe-the-coach thread
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    #18
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    If you look at effective tax rates since 2000, the rate in the US has gone down for every income level under each presidency with the one exception of the effective rate for the highest income level under the Obama administration. And I'm talking taxable income levels of $1 million, not $250,000. Also, that increase was less than the decrease under Bush and the decrease under Trump is more across that board than than Bush or Obama even though it is skewed towards the rich more than Bush (under Obama, the decreases were small even for lower income).

    Anyway, I agree that loopholes are intentional, but don't really think all loopholes are for the greater good. It would be a lot simpler and effective to adjust upper marginal rates and close several loopholes than some of the pie in the sky proposals currently out there.
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    #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master403 View Post
    Your post seems to confuse assets with income. Further, so-called tax breaks or so-called loopholes, are intentional, for the greater good.
    Me and you paying higher tax rates than the ultra-wealthy is for the greater good? LOL. Good ol' trickle down economics!

    Or are you one of the ultra-wealthy, so you see your lower tax rate as the "greater good"?

    The tax breaks and loopholes that benefit the top 0.1% aren't just about charitable contributions.
    If you take Warren Buffett as an example, Berkshire Hathaway employs almost 400,000 at an annual average salary of over $60,000. Assuming 15%, his employees pay $360,000,000 in taxes every year. Given that his salary is about $100,000, what should his income tax rate be?
    He makes hundreds of millions a year in dividends and capital gains, which are taxed at lower rates than his secretary's salary.
    Last edited by 18.99s; 12-05-2019 at 01:17 PM.
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    #20
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    Berkshire Hathaway has not paid a dividend in 52 years. Buffett's long-term capital gains rate is 20%, well above the effective tax rate for $100,000 income.
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