Facts, Not Fiction

 
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    #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by user4 View Post
    We are seeing clear signs of a reduction in T levels, ... across all strata of leadership in the West!
    Bingo! Lots of people in leadership positions are dancing, scared of the SCREAMING minority that seems to be dominating everything right now. It's pretty *@%# shameful. WOMEN are certainly very much under attack.
    You there, on the motorbike! Sell me one of your melons!
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    #22
    Quote Originally Posted by 18.99s View Post
    But in today's track & field, men and women make the same prize money at the same meets. The #10 man of any given event could see a big income boost by becoming the #1 woman and setting meet records and world records. They might even see their endorsement income increase if they find a pro-transgender sponsor.
    But this is about high school and college track and field where there is no money. In pro track and field, the only level at which there is money to be made, the IAAF has already taken care of the problem which is why you didn't see Semenya in Doha.
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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by 18.99s View Post
    It took 10 years to get Semenya out of the picture, and the result was only a lowering of the testosterone cutoff, not an across-the-board exclusion.

    To get an across-the-board exclusion of M-to-F transgender, it's going to take somebody who obliterates the women's world records even while being under the testosterone cutoff.
    Does the IAAF even have a transgender policy? Have there been any instances of transgender athletes competing against women at the highest level of the sport? I thought the only issue thus far has been athletes like Semenya whose sex at birth was ambiguous and who grew up believing they were female.
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    #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukehjsteve View Post
    Back in The Day, age 20-22, I used to whimsically think that if I was a girl, I would be the best HJ'er in the world !
    I was a good but not great, fairly versatile college t&f athlete. I don't recall having such whimsical thoughts at the time but in retrospect, I suspect that my PBs in every event in which I had a PB would have, and some may still, exceed women's WR.
    Of course, I don't even remember women competing in T&F in 1952 but at 5-9, 155#, with long hair, a close shave and a padded bra I probably could have passed as female in those pre-testosterone awareness days.
    Well, there is that visual confirmation thing.
    Last edited by lonewolf; 10-26-2019 at 04:10 PM.
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    #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonewolf View Post
    I was a good but not great, fairly versatile college t&f athlete. I don't recall having such whimsical thoughts at the time but in retrospect, I suspect that my PBs in every event in which I had a PB would have, and some may still, exceed women's WR.
    Of course, I don't even remember women competing in T&F in 1952 but at 5-9, 155#, with long hair, a close shave and a padded bra I probably could have passed as female in those pre-testosterone awareness days.
    Well, there is that visual confirmation thing.
    Awesome there Lonewolf.
    For 11 years my family ran Finale a dinner/theatre operation with a drag queen show. We would have been honoured to have been able to set you up as a Drag-Granny.

    And so you wouldn't have to lonely we could have also setup Duchess Stephanie, these days probably the not so high jumping Queen of the South.
    Last edited by Tuariki; 10-26-2019 at 05:27 PM.
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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by jazzcyclist View Post
    Does the IAAF even have a transgender policy? Have there been any instances of transgender athletes competing against women at the highest level of the sport? I thought the only issue thus far has been athletes like Semenya whose sex at birth was ambiguous and who grew up believing they were female.
    "MtF transgender athletes must lower testosterone to 5 nmol/l for 12 months before competing (same as the intersex regulation) down from 10 nmol/l."

    https://trackandfieldnews.com/discus...af+transgender
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by 18.99s View Post
    Suppose Bruce Jenner won gold in 2016 instead of 1976, and decided to transition soon after and competed in the heptathlon. Easily 8000+ points.

    Winning by small margins at those levels isn't enough. They're already winning at the high school and NCAA D2 level. In order to change minds, there must be utter dominance that shocks the conscience of the viewing public and makes a mockery of the world record.
    While I think that D2 athlete reveals the flaw of the current NCAA policy, her winning time would not even qualify for the D1 final.

    And high school athletes are not required to go through any hormone treatment. I think the solution for those athletes should be mixed gender open competition. High school students are too young to start hormone treatment.
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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by TN1965 View Post
    While I think that D2 athlete reveals the flaw of the current NCAA policy, her winning time would not even qualify for the D1 final.
    Because Telfer was a mediocre as a man, outside the top 200 men of Division II.

    The mediocre men who rise to high levels in the women's ranks don't do enough damage to wake up the powers that be. But if a 49.9 hurdler transitioned and then slashed 1.5 seconds off the women's 400mh world record, that occurrence should have a powerful rule-changing effect.
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    #29
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    Right now we are in the Bad Old Days of transgender sports. In 20 years it will be sorted out and the above examples won't be able to happen. Until then, we're kinda effed.
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    #30
    Quote Originally Posted by jazzcyclist View Post
    I disagree. The Christian Cantwells of the world have no reason to go the transgender route since they can beat the best men in the world. Eventually there will be transgender athletes winning NCAA, USATF Jr. and New Balance Nationals titles and that will force the powers-that-be to act.

    Good thing track athletes don't make the kind of money that top baseball players take home.
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