Facts, Not Fiction

 
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiederganger View Post


    The other thing to point out is the heptathlon tables are based on a rather outdated formula that over-rewards the excellent sprinter/jumpers. I'm going off topic but it's important to consider when you look at 'true' versatility. If you're an average sprinter and an excellent thrower, bad luck, you'll never score big points like the average throwers/excellent hurdlers, jumpers and sprinters. This is not JJKs fault, but it means that when one looks at true versatility, it's very hard to do just by looking at overall scores in the heptathlon, because the Thiam's, Turchinskaya's & Dobrynska's big events will never reward them in the same way.
    13.85 hurdles gets you 1000 pts, a 1.82 HJ does - many of the top heptathletes can do those marks. 23.80 over 200m gets you the same. That's fast, absolutely, but that's why the events draws in sprinter/jumpers. You want 1000 pts in the SP or JT, you have to be able to throw over 17m and 57m, distances that virtually all the top heptathletes simply cannot do.
    This is why I think Thiam is truly versatile. Being able to HJ over 2.02m but also throw over 59m in the JT is amazing.

    Last point, back on topic. It's also difficult to compare times/marks/scores in different eras in this exercise. The 1970's, 80's & early 90's were....different. How can re rectify this when comparing from different eras? Win/loss streaks, head to heads and medals surely have to trump time/distance/mark?
    It's completely irrelevant for which mark in the different events you will get 1.000 points.

    Or if - say 17m in the SP- is worth 1.000 points or 10.000 points. If every centimeter more or less is worth the same, the final result will not be changed at all. (it will be just 9.000 points higher for ANY competitor, in the 2nd case scenario).

    Greatest female athlete of all time? There can't be clear and unique answers to such questions. But for me JJK has very strong arguments on her side. One of the strongest: her PBs are just astonishing, even the 800m and the 400mH. I know very well the arguments for Irena Szewinska (or Marita Koch, FBK, Tirunesh Dibaba...), but I still definitely would vote for JJK. But - as said - other choices definitely are possible.
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    at this point, this thread split off on a tangent on dec vs. hept for women.... it's now its own thread in Current Events
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    a tweet this morning illustrating the greatness of JJK (but I still vote Szewinska):

    <<Jon Mulkeen
    @Statman_Jon

    15h
    On the list of combined points totals of individual PBs in heptathlon events, Thiam moves from 6th to 3rd after today's 6.86m

    The all-time top 10:
    7654 Joyner-Kersee
    7240 Kluft
    7234 Thiam
    7221 Barber
    7201 John
    7183 Ennis-Hill
    7162 Neubert
    7161 Braun
    7118 Turchinskaya
    7101 Behmer>>
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    Senior Member
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    Wow! A 139 point spread from #2 to #10, while JJK laps the field by 414 points. I say again, Wow!
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    Quote Originally Posted by gh View Post
    a tweet this morning illustrating the greatness of JJK (but I still vote Szewinska):

    <<Jon Mulkeen
    @Statman_Jon

    15h
    On the list of combined points totals of individual PBs in heptathlon events, Thiam moves from 6th to 3rd after today's 6.86m

    The all-time top 10:
    7654 Joyner-Kersee
    7240 Kluft
    7234 Thiam
    7221 Barber
    7201 John
    7183 Ennis-Hill
    7162 Neubert
    7161 Braun
    7118 Turchinskaya
    7101 Behmer>>
    Drechsler is not so far behind Nr. 10 with at least 7039 points (not sure about all her PBs at the moment).
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