Facts, Not Fiction

 
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    Quote Originally Posted by tandfman View Post
    Apparently, it is politically incorrect to refer to CeCe as a biological male who now identifies as a woman.
    Instead of 'is', all she has to do is say 'was'.

    e.g., Caitlin Jenner was a biological male, until HE decided to transition to female, which is how SHE now expresses HERself.
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    I believe Caitlin Jenner had the operation. I don't think CeCe Telfer has. Does that matter?
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    Quote Originally Posted by tandfman View Post
    I believe Caitlin Jenner had the operation. I don't think CeCe Telfer has. Does that matter?
    Only in degree of commitment!
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    Quote Originally Posted by user4 View Post
    Ill go one step further, (because user4 always has to) no level of societal acceptance of the "transgender", no opening of avenues to accept them as the opposite sex of their own biology will change the mental anguish they live under. Body dysphoria is between their own ears. No amount of competing against women can change this.

    Only you can make yourself feel good about yourself and a surgeon or a competition with women is not going to solve that problem.

    Only you can do that, and user4 strongly suspects, based on the evidence that nothing society does or changes can eliviate the anguish that these people are living under.
    Very true. When I played golf I read a lot of self-help books - everybody did. One of the first really popular ones was Psycho-Cybernetics, which was written by Maxwell Maltz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell_Maltz), a former cosmetic surgeon.

    Maltz said he decided to write it after doing many cosmetic surgeries and finding that many of his patients still were not happy. He realized that the problem was within and not the appearance, which is probably what is going on with many people with gender dysphoria.
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    Connecticut HS girls sprinters who competed against transgender athletes have filed a Federal Title IX discrimination suit.

    The lawsuit states that “highly competitive girls" are “systematically being deprived of a fair and equal opportunity to experience the ‘thrill of victory,' ” and that the state’s transgender policy has harmed their chances for earning a college scholarship.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.174d06c85d39

    Like many here, I believe biological fairness has to be prioritized over gender identity in athletic competition. However, while I am not a lawyer and certainly not a Title IX expert, I am skeptical of some of the claims.

    I would think that in a sport like track and field, the objectively measured performances would be the primary driver of scholarship opportunities rather than whether the athlete won a state championship.

    Also, isn’t Title IX more about equality of opportunity to participate? Does it also guarantee “the opportunity to experience the thrill of victory?” Seems like a stretch. On the other hand, maybe this kind of legal action is the only way to address the inherent biological unfairness of well-meaning attempts to do right with gender identity issues.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wamego relays champ View Post
    I would think that in a sport like track and field, the objectively measured performances would be the primary driver of scholarship opportunities rather than whether the athlete won a state championship.
    The girls who were bumped out of the final missed an opportunity to run a faster time in the final. And since the top 6 at the CT state meet would qualify for the New England championship, the two finalists who were pushed out of the top 6 also missed that additional opportunity to run faster and be seen by more coaches.

    In some high school districts, the athletes don't get many opportunities to run in a meet with a quality rubberized track with FAT and wind readings.

    Winning a state title or medal is also a good highlight on a college application to highly selective schools, where it's important to shore up one's quantity and quantity of extracurricular achievements (even if they don't expect to run for the college).

    That doesn't really matter to girls who are already running 11.5 or below for the 100m, as they'll get a scholarship from somewhere anyway, but the girls with grievances are running more than 12 seconds, just on the bubble of getting a partial scholarship to a small school if they can improve a little bit more or get more coaches to see them run.
    Last edited by 18.99s; 06-20-2019 at 11:42 PM.
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    There is a TV show on the BBC tomorrow night called "The Trans Women Athlete Dispute with Martina Navratilova" about this very subject. Hopefully, there will be some way that interested people from outside the UK can see it at some stage.
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    Hubbard has recovered from injury, and is outlifting women again.

    http://www.olympic.org.nz/news/two-g...or-david-liti/
    Laurel Hubbard was the pick of the Kiwi lifters as the heavyweights took the stage at the Pacific Games.

    The +87kg lifter snatched 125kgs and clean and jerked 143kgs for a total of 268kgs.

    The lifts saw her take gold in the snatch, silver in the clean and jerk and gold overall.

    The results also saw her win gold in the Oceania and Commonwealth Weightlifting Championships which were run concurrently.
    Samoans took silver and bronze in that competition. The proposed solution? Get transgender lifters on the Somoan team!

    https://www.insidethegames.biz/artic...n-games-unfair
    Loau then reportedly claimed Samoa should "utlise the opportunity" by inviting transgender Samoans and Fa'afafines to join the country's weightlifting team.
    Last edited by 18.99s; 07-18-2019 at 12:26 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bambam1729 View Post
    Very true. When I played golf I read a lot of self-help books - everybody did. One of the first really popular ones was Psycho-Cybernetics, which was written by Maxwell Maltz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell_Maltz), a former cosmetic surgeon.

    Maltz said he decided to write it after doing many cosmetic surgeries and finding that many of his patients still were not happy. He realized that the problem was within and not the appearance, which is probably what is going on with many people with gender dysphoria.
    more digging and I find that the rate of suicide among those that have made the "final cut" is even more dreadful than those that do not.

    Friends, changing ones mind about who you are physically is essential to happiness. Changing your physical self by surgery is useful in some cases, (cleft lip, etc) but for the mental anguish of gender dysphoria the evidence does not look promising. Simply put yourself around people that love and adore you, avoid people that are hateful and live as you were meant to live.
    Last edited by user4; 07-18-2019 at 07:46 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pego View Post
    I am sure, CeCe is so proud.
    I have heard that when she crossed the finish line there wasnt a dry eye in the arena.

    Friends, you can wow and inspire the crowd by lifting more weight than XX females but you will not lift the cloud that troubles you. For that weight is not about your gender.
    Last edited by user4; 07-20-2019 at 01:30 AM.
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