Facts, Not Fiction

 
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    Senior Member
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    Well, so much for the notion that the Brits are more sophisticated than Americans

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/oc ... -nhs/print

    Swine flu fears grow as NHS staff shun vaccine
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    Quote Originally Posted by 26mi235
    Swine flu fears grow as NHS staff shun vaccine
    Quote Originally Posted by The Guardian
    One medical director at another hospital added: "The word on the street in NHS staff circles is that the vaccine is no good and you shouldn't bother with it. Nurses in particular worry that there may be side-effects, that corners have been cut in producing the vaccine and that the generally mild nature of the virus means they don't need to take it. As few as 10%-15% of doctors may have it because we doctors believe ourselves to be above such trivial things as infections."
    Knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance
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    It is a very nasty disease in a small subset of cases (~1:1000), but with many getting the disease, it can be a big problem. A major problem is that the fatality rate among these people will jump when the number of available treatment slots get filled up. The numbers now are such that a surge could easily lead to exceeding the limited capacity to treat intensively. If the rate of severe cases increases from 1:1000 to 1:100, we would already be at the breaking point or past. In my opinion, any doctor or nurse that does not get the vaccine and infects a patient when they get sick is guilty of malpractice and should be liable for their actions. If the insurance companies told the medical people that they will change their rates based on their averting behavior or lack of it it might have some impact on the recalcitrance.

    I hope that I have not exceeded fair use here:

    "CHICAGO (Reuters) - Once swine flu patients are sick enough to need hospital care, they decline very fast, requiring ventilators and advanced treatments that quickly strain scarce hospital resources, several teams reported on Monday.

    Writing in the Journal of the American Medical Association they paint a picture of how younger, previously healthy people quickly developed severe respiratory failure, forcing doctors to use extreme measures to save them."
    ...

    "Kumar said most people who get H1N1 will not have severe disease, which he said only occurs in about 1 in 1,000 patients. "The problem is, if you get half of your population with H1N1, that can turn into a lot of really sick people."

    http://<font size="7">http://www.reu...0091012</font>
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    I just looked at the Texas state flu site and it lists 233 hospitalizations from h1n1. That presumably means at least 233,000 people have had h1n1 since April of this year. As for the original debate, most people are neither pro nor anti flu shot they are just lazy. I get mine because they come to the actual building I work in and I get it for free. The wife and kids have rarely received a flu shot because our family doctor doesn't usually give them and taking the effort to get them other places is more effort than we would normally go to.
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    Quote Originally Posted by donley2
    As for the original debate, most people are neither pro nor anti flu shot they are just lazy. I get mine because they come to the actual building I work in and I get it for free.
    True, easy access like this (which I also have) makes it a lot easier to adopt these vaccines.
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    I doubt Texas has had 230,000 cases yet. Hospitalization include cases that are probably less severe than the severe cases cited above. Two months ago my respiratory doc said that he current (i.e., August) had a case in the hospital on a ventilator and implied that the case was rather significant and if such cases were at all widespread that they would be overwhelmed. If the doctors and staff are also out in elevated numbers the situation would be worse.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bambam
    Quote Originally Posted by tandfman
    There is an old joke about two guys, one Harvard, one Yale, in the men's room. The joke can be told in either direction, I suppose, but the way I first heard it, it went like this, after the Yalie washes his hands and the Harvard man doesn't.

    Yale Guy: You know, at Yale, we wash our hands after we pee.

    Harvard Guy: At Harvard, we don't pee on our hands.
    And the Southern Boy, Harvard joke:

    Southern boy goes up to Harvard as a freshman and gets lost. He is in the yard when he sees a guy with a pipe, tweed coat, looks like a professor so goes up to him looking for help:

    Southern Boy: Sir, can ya'll tell me where the library's at?
    Harvard Prof: My good young man, here at Harvard College, we never end our sentences in a preposition.
    Southern Boy: OK, can ya'll tell me where the library's at, asshole?
    LOL.....

    and gh no one lives forever....live each day like it's your last, one day it will be.
    on the road
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    This is a Marshfield Cinic information I received in yesterday's e-mail. The Marshfield Clinic is a well known multispecialty clinic with presence in many northcentral Wisconsin localities.

    2009 H1N1 Vaccine Information

    If you are interested in learning more about the 2009 H1N1 Influenza Vaccine or are looking for resources to find more information please read:


    Vaccine Safety: The 2009 H1N1 influenza vaccine has been made with the same laboratory and production methods and same approval process used to produce hundreds of millions of doses of the seasonal influenza vaccine each year. Clinical trials with the H1N1 vaccine to date have not turned up any side effects other than the typically mild reactions expected with any immunization.

    The H1N1 vaccine is an extension of the normally provided seasonal vaccine, consider it to be the bonus fourth strain. If this virus strain had appeared earlier in the year it would have been included in the standard seasonal vaccine and would not have been a separate vaccine.


    Vaccine efficacy: In clinical trials to date the efficacy of this vaccine has been 97%. It is an exact match to the currently circulating strain.


    Vaccine Availability: Marshfield Clinic has received the first shipment of H1N1 vaccine, and we anticipate receiving more on a weekly basis. Because of the limited supply of H1N1 vaccine, and high priority that has been placed on vaccination of Health Care workers we encourage all staff to take advantage of the opportunity to be vaccinated to decrease transmission of this virus.

    Live Attenuated Intranasal Vaccine (LAIV) is currently available and approved for administration to individuals between the ages of two to 49 years of age who are not pregnant and are otherwise healthy. We recommend that those employees who qualify to receive the LAIV do so, and reserve the injectable vaccine for those employees and patients who cannot receive LAIV.


    Please use this information to reassure patients and staff about the safety and efficacy of the vaccine.
    "A beautiful theory killed by an ugly fact."
    by Thomas Henry Huxley
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    Quote Originally Posted by bad hammy
    Quote Originally Posted by donley2
    As for the original debate, most people are neither pro nor anti flu shot they are just lazy. I get mine because they come to the actual building I work in and I get it for free.
    True, easy access like this (which I also have) makes it a lot easier to adopt these vaccines.
    Of course, unless you're in a high-risk group, looks like H1N1 isn't in the cards for you anyway. The Beateous Babs works at Stanford Med, so she's had hers (mandatory for any personnel that enter the hospital), but she says there's no way I'll qualify.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gh
    Of course, unless you're in a high-risk group, looks like H1N1 isn't in the cards for you anyway. The Beateous Babs works at Stanford Med, so she's had hers (mandatory for any personnel that enter the hospital), but she says there's no way I'll qualify.
    I thought I read that 250,000,000 (!!!) vaccines were ordered for the USA and the first batches are rolling out now!!!!!
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